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In reply to: forrestgump on Saturday 08/11/08 07:34am

Hi Forrest

 

In case no body has told you, it is the Capitalist system which has just collapsed and if not for a Socialist type rescue, it would not get back up.

 

Interesting that it was the well efficient run capitalist ANSETT which went into liquidation and not the inefficiently Govenment run Qantas. And it went into liquidation at a time of high regulation. Imagine if it had to compete! We won't mention other Ineffiently run organisations like the Commonwealth Bank, electricity utilities, airports, Telstra etc etc.

All set up by "Socialistic" goverments (I wonder how Menzie would feel like being called a socialist) and have had fund managers and merchant banks falling over themselves to buy them at stupid prices from neo conservative govenments.

 

But let's leave ideology aside.

 

Answer me one question. What is the fundamental difference between a Capitalist System and a Socialist System? Don't forget, we are talking about economics here not politics.

 

I agree 100% with you that we can have an efficiently run capitalist system and an ethical system running side by side. Where we get it wrong is that neo conservatives just do not understand what makes a capitalist system work.

 

 

 

 

Regards

 

 

Avenger

 

 

 

 

 

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In reply to: Twobees on Saturday 08/11/08 04:45pm

Hi Twobees

 

Exactly.

 

Its called a mixed economy.

 

There are some things that Entreprenuers can run much better than governments and there are somethings which only govenments will provide.

 

So do you know the answer to the question I have raised?

 

Regards

 

 

Avenger

 

 

 

 

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QUOTE (Avenger @ Saturday 08/11/08 01:57pm)

hi avenger

 

i think i have this covered...

 

A. socialism presumes everyone has the same motivation to work, capitalism accepts there are lazy turds that will bludge and pays them welfare to reduce the crime rate.

 

i have decided to socialise my local ABC Learning Centre (obviously not a place where children learn anything about fiscal responsibility) and due to my highly inappropriate name i have changed it by deed poll to Chairman Mao.

 

the children will be organised into the "Revolutionary Army of Workers and Peasants".

 

so far things haven't worked out well with the experimental farming practices and moving children into steel making has been problematical but i'm sure the allegations of starvation are overstated.

 

http://www.sharescene.com/html/emoticons/tongue.gif

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In reply to: wolverine on Saturday 08/11/08 05:35pm

have decided to socialise my local ABC Learning Centre (obviously not a place where children learn anything about fiscal responsibility) and due to my highly inappropriate name i have changed it by deed poll to Chairman Mao.

========================================================

http://www.sharescene.com/html/emoticons/lmaosmiley.gif

 

when i were year two, i had first english lesson,...............

LONG LIVE CHAIRMAN MAO!! LONG LIVE COMUNIST PARTY!!

DONW WITH USA AND IT'S FOLOWER!!

just imagging 50 little kids pump their fist in to the air, repeat loudly with a haveavy accent "in go lee chi" teacher. that's only 30years ago!

 

 

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In reply to: wolverine on Saturday 08/11/08 05:35pm

Now Now Wolf

 

Sarcasm is not your better side.

 

If we don't understand what we got, how can we protect it?

 

An economic system works within a society. A society has rules and regulations. Or are you proposing that we do away with all regulations of society? I think not.

 

All I am saying is that to have an efficient capitalist system running, we need to understand what make it work. Neo conservatives since Reagan actually thought they were working for capitalism. In fact they were not. They have laid the seed for its destruction. And unless we understand this and stop the rot, we will end up with a similar fate as the Russian or Chinese revolutions.

 

I can be sarcastic also and say that Chinese and Russian (99% of both population) living in semi fuedal states (read semi slavery) prior to the revolutions proves that a captalism society does not work. There were regular famines then also. But who gave a shit about the peasants?

 

Regards

 

 

Avenger

 

 

 

 

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In reply to: Avenger on Saturday 08/11/08 07:26pm

i am convinced it is difficult to get a perfect system.

 

i'm not sure semi-feudal states = capitalism but i know what you are getting at. the same excesses of the rich drove the masses to act to square the books.

 

the problem for socialism comes down to the motivations of people being so different....that and the issue of all people are equal but those in power end up more equal. greed or the desire to have more starts to take hold.

 

capitalism suffers the same fate when greed gets out of control.

 

i was watching a cool documentary on SBS a while ago about one of the longest lasting communes in the USA from the 60's where they were self sufficient and live an idyllic communal life. the last of the original commune starters had finally moved out into a small apartment. she was asked why she left. her reason for leaving was she wanted her "own stuff" just simple nic nac's troll dolls or somesuch but i think it utimately related to giving her sense of identity and feeling of individuality.

 

most of the other communes were also based on communal living and free love which mostly failed due to one person or clique taking a leadership role and taking more of the younger/better looking/more desirable/intelligent women or men.

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In reply to: wolverine on Saturday 08/11/08 07:19pm

We'll never get the perfect system, as whether we are socialists or capitalists we will always believe the other person is getting more than we are and not working as hard for it. We are only human after all. With socialism we are all equally miserable working out guts out for the benefit of those on top, wheras with capitalism we at least can live all our lives under the delusion that one day we can join those on top, which at least makes us happily work our guts out all our lives for the benefit of those on top.

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